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Ellen
Senior Member
173 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2008 : 6:36:17 PM
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| Thibeault does anything he wants when he wants to do it. |
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Tails
Administrator
2682 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2008 : 7:35:06 PM
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That's a good question though. We had a Public Meeting and Thibeault was not allowed to speak. Who gives him Carte Blanch to speak when ever he feels like it. I'm sure a lot of people had questions at the Public Hearing and he hides behind a ONE WAY article and all the Van Campen bashing......timing is all a little too convenient. I'm sending that article to the DEP. Just listen to his words "Van Campen on a Soap Box and Grandstanding".
Are the employees at Stop & Shop grandstanding? Was the lady that had to move out of her home because she couldn't take Wood Waste's obnoxious fumes anymore grandstanding? Was the lady with the Asthma problems grandstanding? The same lady that had to get up in the middle of the night because she hung up her sheets and she lives across the highway! I can go on and on and all Thibeault has to say is he "Crying to the Papers over Van Campen" What a wimp.
Sounds like people are nervous...and using Big Bad Thibeault to show just "how bad" they are.
My favorite line was "If this is the avenue Van Campen chooses, he's best do the same with Schnitzer,Exxon, Mobil and the multiple scrapyards."
First off.....these are the same words DeMaria used before so don't tell me that Carlo and "Buddy Billy" did not put their heads together on that one. Google Billy then Google Schnitzer and see who has the violations and "who" is breaking environmental laws. What a jerk. |
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SillyPutty
Member
2 Posts |
 Posted - 12/18/2008 : 06:02:10 AM
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The Everett Independent article/snow job attempted to do three things, unsuccessfully:
1. Whitewash Woodwaste/Thibeault
2. Make DeMaria look reelectable as a "fighter for the people"
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3. Take a cheap shot at Robert Van Campen by accusing him of using the matter to launch his campaign.
Let's take those things in order:
1. Thibeault: They can try to put lipstick on the pig by putting out this Bill Thibeault unplugged, but people well remember it is this same man that is claiming his benevolance helps the children, fire department, and police department of Everett is one in the same that called up the Newburyport Board of Health Director and leaves a message laced with obsceneties and implied threats. The language was right out of a Sopranos episode. This is also the same man who flies a skull and crossbones flag at the Newburyport landfill to display his contempt for the force of law. The gentler & kinder William Thibeault.......... what a joke. We know who he is and more importantly, what he is. Ditto for DeMaria, which brings us to door number 2.
2. DeMaria being reelectable: The minute DeMaria sat down at the table with Thibeault sometime between last July and September was the day he compromised his ability to represent the people of Everett in good faith on Woodwaste or any other important matters. From that point forth, he not only compromised his ability to represent Everett residents in good faith, but also compromised any of his own principles he may have had prior to that meeting. Of course no one can prove DeMaria took any cash but that is what bribery thrives on, the fact that cash is tough to trace. It was common knowledge among the political folks in Everett during the last several election cycles that Thibeault has been throwing around (or offering) large amounts of money for favorable attention on the Woodwaste matter.
It was also plainly known in the gosspi circles that Joe McGonagle refused $50,000 cash from Thibeault but yet we never heard of DeMaria either being offered or refusing any such illegal donation. DeMaria would have us believe that it never happened to his campaign. Sure, we'll just go ahead and believe Thibeault took DeMaria off the bribe list because he was/is so uncorruptable. What a laugh. To bad someone didn't go to the FBI but the code of silence lives on in Everett politics.
For DeMaria to claim he "inherited" this mess is disingenuous at best. He knew before he even won the election where he would have to go with this if he indeed did win, and now he is stuck with having made his deal with the devil. Even folks with no major interest in Everett politics can see that he is doing well for himself in quite a few ways. In no uncertain terms, DeMaria is a thief and he has surrounded hiimsellf with like minded people.
Everything that DeMaria has done politically speaking from there on out is suspect as having some ulterior motive connected to either Thibeault or the selling of a job in exchange for campaign support (reelection). It is either one or the other for anything DeMaria does. One cannot deny his lifestyle has fast improved with a $900,000 house and new Mercedes Benz. That little hole in the wall he calls a donut shop is not producing that kind of money, of that we are certain.
That leaves number door number 3, the cheap shot at Robert Van Campen. Thibeault claims RVC is standing up on this now because he wants to run for Mayor? He (Thibeault) claims this is a new interest with Robert and that he had no interest "two weeks ago?" Bull.
Was he at the same public meeting back in October when Robert stood up against it or weeks before when the ordinance against open air dumps was proposed by Robert? So, he is telling me that God forbid, a guy who wants something good for Everett is using the opportunity to also run for Mayor? How dare RVC do that. We can't have someone who actually wants something good for Everett standing up there like that? It will give the honor among thieves a bad name.
There is no late arrival on this for Van Campen. While everyone but him has declded and claims he is running for Mayor, exactly what is Thibeault suggesting? That if in fact it is true he runs for Mayor that he is supposed to lie down on his obligation to represent the city in good faith as he (and all other elected officials, including the Mayor) have sworn to do and NOT address this? The bottom line is they are afraid of Van Campen and whatever attempts that were being made to take shots at him simply fell off him with the little power they had in the first place.
All the article did was reinforce my belief that Van Campen will stand up for what is right and has the knowledge and stamina to see this through to a conclusion which will benefit the residents. The way I see it, this charade simply makes Robert's point all the more valid. Woodwaste is a dirty business that has no interest in anything other than profiteering.
As for Thibeault's claims; if operating a business with "potential violations" is the problem and he feels Van Campen should go after the other violaters too, then Billy will just have to wait, but I'm quite sure Mayor Van Campen will get to them sometime early in 2010. You can count on it!! :)
If one were to buy into Thibeault's logic, then he'd claim it was the Jews fault that made Hitler a bad man. They truley operate as the masters of Jabberwocky at city hall. What is... isn't... What isn't.. is... up is down and down is up... Billy Thibeault is a victim and Demaria didn't know what he was getting into with Woodwaste.........he inherited the mess... yup.. it all fits together nicely.
Last but not least, I'd like to thank Thibeault and the Independent for helping point out that this is just the type of good moral character that Robert possesses that we need in city hall. He indeed will make a fine Mayor.
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n/a
deleted
136 Posts |
Posted - 12/19/2008 : 2:46:34 PM
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| The thing that Mr Thibeault forgets to say is in years before the trash was going to the landfill. Its never been as bad as it is today. The everett board of health tried to do something. Remember the story Reeking Havoc in 2006? Years before the the DEP didnt issue injunctions either. This is different now. He made millions on Woodwaste last year and if gets the 99 spot he'll make millions more ontop of his millions. |
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Tails
Administrator
2682 Posts |
Posted - 12/19/2008 : 6:05:40 PM
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I also heard he made 45 Million last year from Wood Waste. You absolutely right, add quite a few more million to that if he gets lower Broadway and he will own Everett. He will run rampant and do whatever he wants. That's what he always does.
Reeking Havoc has been posted here before. Here is a paragraph-
"Frustration is growing in Everett, DeVito said. The city is sending regular letters to the DEP, the attorney general and Gov. Mitt Romney, urging them to take action, but DeVito said that with the exception of one returned phone call, their attempts have been futile."
The DEP have finally woken up since they are the ones that are going to be liable for lawsuits for sitting on their hands. We can’t loose that leverage and that’s exactly what this consent order will do. This is not about removing piles this is all about MONEY and he’s running out of room. He can care less that he has all those piles and he can care less about people’s health problems. If he did care…..with all the millions he makes….he would have said “ My business is hurting people, I’m building and enclosed facility for the safety of the children and elderly in the area (actually…all people) and I will deal with a relocation at the same time. He made 45 million……..he could have built a building instead of a tent in the interest of public safety and he NEVER did. He has NO ROOM…that’s what this is all about and he has piles in Chelsea which is part of the preliminary injunction that he needs to get rid of……so what does the City of Everett go and do?? HELP HIM and make it look like the consent order is in the best interest.
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massdee
Moderator
5299 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 8:36:24 PM
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From today's Independent 12/30/08
Mayor and Board of Aldermen begin to compromise on Wood Waste
By Keith Spencer
The Board of Alderman held deliberations for more than hour at last week’s meeting over Mayor Carlo DeMaria’s proposed enforcement order against Wood Waste of Boston and its operations on Boston Street. The order comes after the entire Board of Alderman cosponsored a measure calling for an immediate cease and desist order against the company.
“While I’m not happy about this falling in my lap, I think this agreement is a good first step and will give us some teeth in any future litigation,” said Mayor DeMaria.
The enforcement order, which was published in last week’s Independent, calls for air quality testing, de-odorizing of current debris piles, and the submission of plans to construct a permanent, enclosed facility by March. DeMaria noted that he believed the greatest benefit to the agreement would be that Wood Waste and the city would enter into an official agreement requiring plans for an entirely enclosed facility by March 1st.
The agreement lays out several stipulations that hold Wood Waste and its owner responsible to make corrective action within seven days of any violation. If action is not taken within the given time frame, the city could seek relief from the courts and Wood Waste would face a series of fines.
The end result of violations was of the highest concern to members of the BOA, with Alderman Chuck DiPerri and Alderman Robert Van Campen calling for stronger language in regards to penalties issued for violating the agreement. Both aldermen called for a cease and desist order to be issued if the company fails to comply with any aspect of the enforcement agreement.
“I do not think a consent order is going to resolve the issues that persist at that location,” said Van Campen. “Unfortunately, the board received the draft consent agreement†literally minutes before the meeting. We didn't have much time to digest it before the discussions which occurred at the meeting.”
Alderman Van Campen, a vocal critic of Wood Waste, raised concerns about the enforcement order, citing his distrust for the owner of Wood Waste. He repeatedly called for the mayor to simply issue a cease and desist order, citing years of violations and failures to comply with injunctive orders brought by the DEP on behalf of Everett and other municipalities in the commonwealth.
“I don't distrust anyone,” said Van Campen later in the week. “What concerns me is that the history of Wood Waste in Everett†has been†nothing more than a number of violated agreements, hollow commitments, and misleading promises to the people of Everett.”
“As a†member of the Board of Aldermen charged with the responsibility of determining what is and is not in the best interests of the people of Everett, I cannot operate on the assumption that this company is finally going to start following the rules,” said Van Campen simply. “The consent order will only be worth as much as the paper it is written on.”
Despite his criticism, Van Campen agreed with Alderman DiPerri that the board could work with the mayor. However, both called for the end result of any violations to be an immediate cease and desist order rather than a series of fines. Van Campen stated his belief that this stipulation could drive Wood Waste to not sign an agreement.
“Unfortunately, I do not believe this company will agree to that type of†language in the consent agreement, especially given its track record,” stated Van Campen. “Although I have publicly said I will support any†efforts to solve this problem once and for all, I would be hard-pressed to support a consent agreement that does not result in a cease and desist order for failure to abide by its terms.”
City Solicitor Colleen Mejia and Mayor DeMaria both responded to DiPerri’s and Van Campen’s suggestion, noting that a cease and desist order was an end result they had already been considering.
“I think that the company and its owner would be willing to agree to this stipulation. It would show their commitment to meeting the demands of our agreement,” said Mejia.
Both the mayor and Mejia also revealed that the administration’s discussions with the Department of Environmental Protection and Jack Moss, the city of Newburyport’s Board of Health director, led them to pursue an enforcement agreement rather than a cease and desist order.
“We took guidance from Jack Moss, and we think that we can learn a lot from Newburyport’s situation and their litigation with Mr. Thibeault and his company,” said Mejia. “After much discussion, Moss agreed that the best route for the city to take at this point is an enforcement agreement.”
Mayor DeMaria expressed his frustration over the politics of the controversial issue, noting that this has plagued two other administrations as well. He asked for the board and residents to work with him to find resolve in this issue, rather than jump the gun. DeMaria clearly expressed his distaste for an immediate cease and desist order, fearing the city would simply not have enough evidence to enter into successful litigation against Wood Waste.
“I came into office, and within 10 months I have the owner agreeing to measures that the last two administrations were unable to get,” said DeMaria. “I think this enforcement order is a big win for the city of Everett.”
DeMaria also responded to Van Campen’s distrust of Wood Waste owner William Thibeault. The mayor noted that he would take “the slap in the face” if Thibeault’s company violated the agreement. However, the city would then have the necessary evidence to successfully pursue any litigation against the company.
“I feel like this is the best step to take first in the process of getting things moving,” said DeMaria. “Even if he violates the agreement, I’ll know that I explored every option available to me before entering into litigation.”
After a lengthy discussion, the BOA tabled the agreement until their next meeting, allowing time for members to make suggestions and input ideas. The DeMaria administration would then work on getting a final draft of the agreement signed by both the city of Everett and the owner of Wood Waste.
“As for other terms I would like to see in the agreement, I think the time lines contained in the agreement need to be†more clearly defined, and they need to be†as short as possible,” said Van Campen. “I have no objection with Wood Waste submitting plans by March 1,†but the City of Everett should also require construction to commence and end on dates certain.”
“Further, assuming†the†Newburyport lawsuit does not resolve in favor of Wood Waste, the consent agreement should also spell out an alternative course should the Crowe Lane†landfill not be available to Wood Waste to remove their Everett debris piles,” noted Van Campen.
While the BOA’s approval of the agreement is not needed, DeMaria noted that he wants to work cooperatively with the board in reaching an agreement that would truly benefit the city. DeMaria informed members that a final draft would be submitted for review before his office and the Board of Health enter into the agreement.
† “I feel that the administration is not being as aggressive as it should be in this matter,” said Van Campen. “I certainly appreciate the administration's effort in putting a consent agreement together, but it doesn't go far enough in addressing pile heights, resolving possible zoning violations at the site, and achieving a permanent solution that no longer pollutes our air, harms our residents and damages business growth in the area.”
While the board did go ahead and unanimously vote to recommend a cease and desist order against the company, they acknowledged that the ball was in the mayor’s court and their power was indeed limited.
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Tails
Administrator
2682 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 9:35:09 PM
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Does anyone know what in the heck this means in todays legal notice?
Legal Notice
PURCHASING DEPARTMENT
The city of Everett is seeking responses to a request for the qualifications for the following:
“The city of Everett is seeking the services of a consulting firm to peruse a course of study and evaluation to determine the strategic real estate opportunities associated with specific municipal properties. The responses must be received at the office of the Procurement Officer, City Hall, Everett Massachusetts 02149 no later than 10:00 AM Friday, January 16, 2009 for the following and opened at the time(s) specified:
Full specifications and information available in the office of the Chief Procurement Officer 617-394-2290 Jill Barringer Chief Procurement Officer.
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tetris
Moderator
2040 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 11:03:59 PM
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To me, it looks like they're trying to find someone to help them figure out what to do with the old high school; and, by extension, if they decide to re-use it for other municipal purposes, what to do with other buildings that might no longer be needed.
I think that it is actually a good move. I believe that it it is a key decision that the city will have only one chance to make; it has to be made right. It'll cost some money but it should be worth it in the long run if they can hire the right person and/or firm. It should have been budgeted for though. It's my opinion that the budget needs to be the blue print for what you expect to accomplish in the next fiscal year and you need to plan that far ahead.
I recall the Mayor mentioning an RFQ during the Boys & Girls Club discussion at the the last BOA meeting. However, I wasn't sure what it was at the time. |
Edited by - tetris on 12/30/2008 11:08:46 PM |
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tetris
Moderator
2040 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 3:01:35 PM
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From this week's Independent's editorial page
The enigmatic Robert Van Campen
Alderman Robert Van Campen makes no bones about it to friends and political allies – he’d like to one-day be the mayor of Everett.
With increasingly public, contentious and honest stands on a variety of issues of interest to Everett voters, he seems to be leaning toward a run for mayor but is hesitant to take the plunge.
Over the years of his political career, Van Campen has looked and acted as though he was going to jump into the frying pan. But as Everett political history shows, he has not found the desire to get burned.
That’s what happens when you jump into the frying pan.
Former mayors David Ragucci and John Hanlon and present mayor Carlo DeMaria all have one thing in common. When push came to shove, they all threw their fate to the wind, placed their names on the ballot, and ran for the corner office at city hall.
Running for mayor here or anywhere, for that matter, is an act of hubris – that is – self-confidence is everything.
Everyone who runs believes they can win.
Politicians who sit on the sideline endlessly adding and subtracting whether or not they can win before deciding to run are at a disadvantage when thinking about running against those who believe they cannot lose.
Mayor DeMaria looks strong at this point in his administration.
He’s done the right thing with voters, residents, city hall types and he’s been on the job and highly visible for everyone to see.
In our opinion, DeMaria will be a tough candidate to beat for re-election.
However, with Van Campen posturing for a possible mayoral run, anything is possible.
Van Campen expresses the kind of high mindedness that is unique to himself in this city’s political arena.
He is a lawyer, a very careful guy who views the world through a lawyer’s sense of what is right and what is wrong.
He would make a very interesting candidate for mayor.
But until he stops equivocating, his chances of taking on DeMaria and winning diminish with every passing day.
At some point, all of us make up our minds about what we are going to do with ourselves in this world.
The big question in local politics is this: when will Robert Van Campen make up his mind about running for mayor? |
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Tails
Administrator
2682 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 3:11:12 PM
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Who wrote that editorial? Was it the one Resnick writes? Did any of the former Mayors/candidates for mayor….or even Mayor DeMaria announce before the spring? I don’t believe so. But, the newspapers are trying to force RVC’s hand, so he can sell newspapers, I wouldn’t bite at that bait.
Quote: But until he stops equivocating, his chances of taking on DeMaria and winning diminish with every passing day.
That line sounds blatantly familiar.
"blatantly, gone are the days" |
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tetris
Moderator
2040 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 4:24:54 PM
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It seems as if at least the two local papers have it out for Alderman Van Campen. We'll update the ongoing Advocate saga at some point Independent's edtorial page.
It does seem that we've been hearing about Alderman Van Campen thinking about running for mayor for a long time. If some of the rumors that were floated at the time were true, Alderman Van Campen was considering running for Mayor the last time around if Mayor Hanlon had decided not to run for re-election. Since the last election, Alderman Van Campen's name has been the one most often floated as Mayor DeMaria's next logical opponent, especially since Joe McGonagle seemed to disappear back into private life after the last election. At a televised Ward 5 meeting last winter, the alderman's own father raised the possibility. One could interpret some of the alderman's actions over the last year as a sign that he would be running for mayor next year; I've made a few posts of that type myself.
To decide to run for the position of mayor is a big decision. It's hard to unseat a sitting mayor. I'm sure that the opinions on Mayor DeMaria performance run a spectrum. I don't believe that we can determine from our little slice of the political world how likely voters are distributed over that spectrum. But if Mayor DeMaria has been able to retain a good portion of his base and his financial backing is as strong as we have been led to believe, I agree with the Independent; he might be hard to beat. In order for Alderman Van Campen to compete, he will also need to find some strong financial backing. Since he is not his own boss, he may find it necessary to give up his day job in order to run; so he needs to consider own personal financial situation as well. He also needs to find out if it is probable that more of the likely voters in the next election share his vision for the future of the city rather than Mayor DeMaria's. I agree with the Independent's assertion that, at some point, Alderman Van Campen will have to take a leap of faith; but, I don't agree that the time for that has to be now or at some point we have already passed.
I think that it is a good thing that Alderman Van Campen is taking his time to make the correct decision for himself. It's not time to pull nomination papers yet and he doesn't need even to pull those early on in that process if he doesn't what to. In my opinion, it would be a good idea to pull papers early on in this election because of the scope of the challenge; but that's his decision to make.
In the last city election, we used to have a thread on this board where we tracked the candidates that had pulled papers for all of the various city seats (Nomination Papers, if you are interested). Once the original list was established, it would get updated with information from newspaper articles and substantiated rumors. DeMaria's name didn't show up in that thread as a candidate for mayor until the middle of May. Originally, he was only listed as candidate for re-election to his Alderman At-Large seat. Oh, and by the way, the original source of that list of people who had pulled nomination papers for the various seats was an piece from the editorial page of the Independent!
Each of the papers has the right to back the candidate of their choice. But what they shouldn't be allowed to do is to back and rewrite history to suit their own agenda. |
Edited by - tetris on 01/09/2009 4:26:54 PM |
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tetris
Moderator
2040 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 7:48:02 PM
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Also from this week's Independent's editorial page:
The truth about taxes
By Robert Van Campen
Alderman Ward 5
My fellow citizens:
Like each of you, I recently received my tax bill for Fiscal Year 2009. Like some of you, the tax bill on my home went slightly down. To some, this year's tax bill was good news. In the January 2nd Everett Advocate the headline sought to create the perception that this was entirely due to the fiscal responsibility of the DeMaria Administration. That article asserted that our tax bills have "stabilized" because of the DeMaria Administration's ability to get the skyrocketing city budget under control. This is completely false. Due to the dangerous misperception that can get created by such a misinformed article, I am writing to present the people of Everett with the unvarnished truth about their tax bills.
First, the tax rates that will be effective in the City of Everett for Fiscal Year 2009 are based upon a budget, proposed by the DeMaria Administration, which increased spending by $8,000,000 over Mayor John Hanlon's final budget in Fiscal Year 2008. The residential tax rate for the City of Everett increased from $10.35 per thousand in Fiscal Year 2008 to $11.18 per thousand in Fiscal Year 2009. In addition, the Commercial, Industrial, Personal Property tax rate increased from $24.61 per thousand in Fiscal Year 2008 to $28.98 per thousand in Fiscal Year 2009. Although, the public relation apparatus that has recently taken our public dialogue hostage would like you to believe there is stability in the city's finances, the unvarnished facts show just the opposite. If you own a home - whether a single, two or three family - your tax rate has increased by 83 cents per thousand. If you own a commercial property in Everett today - if you're a small business in our city - your tax rate has increased by $4.37 per thousand! Assuming the assessment on your home or business - the value - stayed the same as last year, your share of the tax burden in Everett would have increased by 83 cents per thousand of value and $4.37 per thousand for a commercial building. My fellow citizens, this is not fiscal responsibility.
As an example, my wife Lisa and I own the home that we live in on Harley Avenue. We have owned the property for almost five years. It's where we raise our daughter Lily. It's where we have invested thousands of dollars for improvements and upgrades. It's where we spend a great deal of our time. Like most of you, its our largest financial asset. In Fiscal Year 2008, when the residential tax rate was $10.35 per thousand, we paid $2,971.85 in taxes. The Fiscal Year 2009 bill which we recently received has us scheduled to pay $2,749.67 in taxes. To understand why my bill, perhaps like yours, is actually dropping, you do not need to look any further than your assessed value. With the residential exemption included for Fiscal Year 2008, my wife Lisa and I were taxed on $287,135 in value. In Fiscal Year 2009 - for the same home with the residential exemption factored in again - we are being taxed on $245,945 in value. Although I can certainly use the extra $200 this year, this is hardly good news. What this picture shows is that I have lost almost $45,000 in value on my home. This lower tax bill has nothing to do with the actions of the DeMaria Administration, and everything to do with the collapsed real estate market that is driving residential real estate values in our city further down. However, if the DeMaria Administration wishes to take the credit for our tax bills going down, can I also assume that it is also willing to take credit for the drastic devaluation of our homes?
The great statesman Adlai Stevenson once remarked "if they stop telling falsehoods about us, I will stop telling the truth about them." We the people of Everett deserve nothing less than the cold, unvarnished truth when it comes to taxes, or any other issue. The facts could not be clearer when it comes to your recent tax bill. The budget which the DeMaria Administration proposed for the City of Everett - which I voted against - jumped an additional $8,000,000 from FY08 to FY09. Unfortunately for the hardworking people of Everett, the real estate market collapsed at the same time - and they lost hundreds of thousands of dollars in value. If you are like me, you just lost thousands of dollars in your largest financial investment. If you are a senior citizen, you just watched something you worked your entire life for reduce in value virtually overnight. If you are on a fixed income - and many Everett residents are these days - you just lost the much needed equity in your home. In essence, had your real estate value not decreased, your tax bill would have increased again. The New Year is a time for truthful, serious efforts to achieve much needed, long-term solutions for the people of Everett. This is not the time to deploy a hollow public relations machine which has as its purpose the pursuit of everything but the truth. |
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jcklla
Member
32 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 10:28:57 PM
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That editorial is a perfect example of the phrase: when a person is so smart they're stupid.
He thinks he is going to convince people to be upset about their tax bill going down. |
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tetris
Moderator
2040 Posts |
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 10:41:35 PM
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Although I do agree with most, if not all of, the conclusions in Alderman Van Campen's letter to the editor, I do have to take some exception with some of the statements that are labeled as "the cold, unvarnished truth". First off, although the statement that the FY09 budget went up $8 million (or so; the exact amount is hard to determine) is true, but why is the fact that approximately $5.9 million of that increase was a state mandated increase in the school budget that was completely funded by a corresponding increase in Chapter 70 funds not included? Also, the claims that if your property had not lost so much of it's value that you would still be paying the current FY09 tax rates is just wrong. Although, I don't understand all of the math involved and would probably have a hard time explaining it if I did, I do understand enough to know that his statement on what the rates would be if valuations had not changed so dramatically is just wrong.
Let's try to explain using the easiest possible example. The amount of money needed to be raised in property taxes, the tax levy, is calculated and becomes a fixed number. In the simplest single rate system, the tax rate would be determined by dividing the tax levy amount by the total value of all of the properties in the city. Your tax bill would then be determined by multiplying the tax rate by the value of your property. No matter what the value of property is, the same amount of money must be raised for the tax levy. So, if the value of property goes down, you would have to multiply by it by a larger number to get to the same tax levy amount. If the property value is higher, you would need a smaller number to get the same tax rate. That's just basic math.
The system used in this city is a little more difficult as there are different rates for residential and commercial tax payers. This is done by adopting the Minimum Residential Factor. This is the math that I don't quite understand. But, the bottom line of it is that it determines how much of the total tax levy will be paid by the residential payers and how much will be picked up by the corporate payers. Though I don’t understand all the math involved, part of it has do with property values. Since residential values fell so badly and commercial values held up relatively well or increased in total, more of the tax burden has been shifted to the corporate payers by lowering the percentage of the levy that has to be paid by residential tax payers. Somebody had to make up for the $4 million dollars that the tax levy amount has increased since FY08 and to make up for the reduction in the residential taxes; so the corporate tax payers got whacked.
As I stated previously, even though I dispute some of his facts, I agree with Alderman's Van Campen's conclusions. I posted as much in the Advocate thread last week. So, there's no need to revisit it in this post.
Although this topic can be complicated, especially for those don't have the necessary math skills, I don't understand why unwarranted claims need to be made when discussing it. I've noticed that this topic is on the BOA agenda for next Monday night. Let's hope that it can finally be discussed frankly and without any "embellishments". |
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Tails
Administrator
2682 Posts |
Posted - 01/10/2009 : 10:14:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by jcklla
That editorial is a perfect example of the phrase: when a person is so smart they're stupid.
He thinks he is going to convince people to be upset about their tax bill going down.
My opinion of his letter was due to the recent articles "Mayor stabilizes residential tax bills" and articles to that nature.
That is 100% false. This administration has not stabilized anything. If anything, they spend more than before. The budget increased and there is no need for the taxpayers to pay extreme high salaries and 13 positions created in city services.
My tax bill went down a very small amount compared to the value of my home. If the market had not gone downhill, we all would have had an increase. To try and take credit, when credit is NOT due, is childish. If they can lie about that too, I cant imagine all the other lies being told.
"blatantly, gone are the days" |
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Everett Independent
